And so as you mature you look for a different kind of investor and that naturally tends to happen. Originally from London, he has an MBA from Harvard Business School, MPhil from the University of Cambridge, and BA from the University of Oxford. Saying that, I have connections through both business school and previous people that have gone through BCG venture capital and most of your listeners and entrepreneurs will know so much of this is about like getting warm introductions to VCs so I did have a couple of cheats to get in through the network or through the BCG network. Over time, its great to be able to bring in your team. It was kind of [31:51] as early as we did to buy another stock up that was kind of four years in. Yes, weve raised $90 million in capital including a series C that we just closed three months ago. This show is about storytelling and all the elements that go into telling the perfect fundraising story. anthemos georgiades net worth. Your job as the CEO and the founder is to convince your investors of the reason to do this. Got it. Yeah. So I saw NEA, Kleiner Perkins, Graylog, Andreesen Horrowitz, just to name a few. I mean to a point network gets you an intro but a lot of intros are 10 minute meetings where the VC immediately decides its not for them which is totally fair. After that, it changed to more consumer. Alrightee. Im the CEO and Ive always felt that it was my responsibility to do the fundraising. And were just a little earlier than obviously a public company so our gross is spikier. Thiel was the first angel investor in Facebook with a $500K check that turned into more than $1 billion in cash. Yeah, sure. After that, it changed to more consumer. You kind of just all in [06:39] I think where the carving of the rose start to happen for me around 10, 12 people where you no longer just have [06:49]. Were very clear with Axle Springer that we have a lot of consumer scale so a lot of people use our platform on a monthly basis but were still building the [21:55]. Your job is to raise capital and your job is to kind of hire and retain the best talents. So we want to be the first ever kind of full stack rental platform for long term leases and we monetize that two ways. It is ultimately the culture. Whats your story and most importantly, how did you get started with the entrepreneurial bug? I think its easy not to set those expectations and get caught in the relationship where neither side is being clear on what they expect. Anthemos Georgiades CEO at Zumper United States 4K followers 500+ connections Join to view profile Zumper Harvard Business School Websites Websites Company Website http://www.zumper.com Company. They may not understand marketplace as well as you but they may be able to bring a brilliant way of thinking about how to bring the supply on [30:20]. Were going to charge you per lead or for the smaller landlords we charge them if theyre [11:15] for the transaction. As CEO, Anthemos has raised $39.2 million in venture capital from investors including Kleiner Perkins, Goodwater Capital, Breyer Capital and Foxhaven Asset Management, including a Series B round in Oct. 2016 when many start-ups were struggling. Anthemos Georgiades: Yeah. Yeah. You know its interesting that you mentioned the chicken and the egg. Alejandro: So I guess in just to like follow up on that, what in your mind and obviously in what youve seen creates really that magical relationship between cofounders? I guess the question that I would ask you and perhaps some advice for some of those that are listening, that are building a business that is more around the network effects, the marketplaces, should they walk the other way if the investor is asking too much about revenue early on on the financing cycles? The one unifying theme in every fundraising Ive run is momentum. It just really helps to divide and conquer like that while I was meeting new investors again. You start to build depth and management structures. And were just a little earlier than obviously a public company so our gross is spikier. Anthemos Georgiades: So Zumper is the vision for the company is to make renting an apartment as easy as booking a hotel. So you kind of just have to [25:29] but just to be clear yeah, we had far more nos than yeses at the seed round. In terms of the dynamics, I think in the early days, you kind of through osmosis graduate towards like the things that are important. You always have more nos that more yeses in fundraising but it was ultimately about just hustling my network as much as possible. In terms of the dynamics, I think in the early days, you kind of through osmosis graduate towards like the things that are important. It has to be me and thats how I started the company six years ago after business school. So our CFO is fantastic and what he was able to bring to the series C was real credibility where I meet the investors, get them excited about our vision and our story and then they spend hours with the CFO on the second or third meeting digesting our historical financial as were talking about where were headed. It was not something Ive really ever thought about before. Alejandro: So I guess like I have one thing to follow up on this. Alejandro: Got it. Yeah, I mean BCG I think you get access to the 23 year olds CEOs who had been working for 40 years and kind of crazy in consulting you take the shortcut in your careers to being in the board room. Anthemos Georgiades: Yeah. Im so glad I did it. And I mean its quite a few cofounders. There was no book [01:41]. Like many of our most successful entrepreneurs, Anthemos Georgiades was drawn into startup life to solving a burning problem. Anthemos Georgiades: Yeah, sure. So I saw for example Axle Springer which is you know more kind of like the corporate. So cofounders are difficult especially if youre not technical as really hard to find a good technical cofounder but the great thing is once you do and it takes a long time, they are able to attract the next generation of talent in to the company and thats how you kind of build your engineering team out. What are some tips for successfully navigating the rental market from a renter's perspective? We also actually had a really wonderful fourth cofounder whos no longer with us. Got it. So the series B, weve done story now look at how quickly the renters are growing on the platform. Since 2012, Anth has grown Zumper to over 100 employees and raised $90 million in venture capital for the company. So it was never I want to be an entrepreneur journey. I think if you set these expectations from the very beginning that are super important. The company was incorporated in California, Texas, and Florida ten years ago. So the way we monetize this is we either monetize the landlord mainly and we either charge them to leads. Well, today's guest noticed that experience and wanted to improve it. How many listings do we have on the site? They are the two ways that Zumper currently monetizes them and there are two folks that [11:35]. Retention is something I think about every day. It just really helps to divide and conquer like that while I was meeting new investors again. Thats just part of the game. Prior to his work at Zumper, Georgiades worked at the Boston . Had worked at the Boston Consulting Group. I was really impressed when because its not hard, its almost impossible to land VC such as Kleiner Perkins on literally your first financing round, the seed round. 1. Youre right that is wrong advice. His passion for relieving the stress for others in apartment rentals has given birth to a venture which has now raised $90 million, has experienced tremendous growth, and boasts a VC line up of some of the most prized investors in Silicon Valley. It was at the time Pat Mapper example almost the same size on consumer but now Zumper is much bigger but we called it like a cheat and your job as the founder is to identify like vertical cheats where overnight you become bigger than your competitors. In the early days we love the exposure to Silicon Valley investors. If you want me to do your fundraising for you, click here. There could be investors who are fantastic. I mean I called it like a cheat [33:33] my team. They take every, some people go and warm theirif you have a brilliant idea, theyd be crazy not to take it and then their entire value is obviously give you a three month program and then at the end expose you to liek 40 investors. I was just talking to a friend of mine about this. Since 2012, Georgiades has grown Zumper to over 200 employees, 178 million annual visits, and raised $178 million in venture capital for the company. You know its interesting that you mentioned the chicken and the egg. So one is weve always promoted within so whenever we needed a role, we always prefer to promote someone instead of hiring from outside. Yeah. Its just part of the game and it doesnt [24:30]. So yes, we have a great cap table. Of course. Got it. So I guess for those listeners that are looking at acquiring other companies to perhaps grow a little bit faster, what kind of advice would you give to them? And frankly, the process is a pain in the ass. Not really actually. Alejandro: Got it. So I learned a lot from a few companies that I loved, a few companies that I thought are doing crazy things I learned so much. Alejandro: Just out of curiosity, Anthemos, like how many nos did you get for example on your seed round if you have to count it? There could be investors who are fantastic. Zumper Board Member Related Hubs I mean if you could give some kind of like tips you know both fronts it would be really fantastic. So you acquire not long ago Pat Mapper and how did this come together? Thank you so much. You can filter down by city and . Culture is everything and so investing in people making sure I as the CEO spend a lot of time as much as possible with people who dont report to me is absolutely critical and that is ultimately like the fabric on how most companies are run. You just cant get spooked. Youre supposed to try six things that dont work. It was always a man, there is a really tough problem that consumers experience and no one is solving it. So you know I think Axle Springer very used to appraising companies that match their scale. But oh we must have had like 20 persons or 20 people say not now or later. So I saw NEA, Kleiner Perkins, Graylog, Andreesen Horrowitz, just to name a few. So we have several million users using our platform every month now which is great and next year we wanted tens of millions of users a month and were poised to doing that. So I guess in your guys case, how do you deal with the egos and then more importantly how did you define the responsibilities early on so that you kind of have that healthy culture going on? 1.4.1 - Provisions of this Code Declared . In the early days you as the CEO you are the fundraiser, you are the effective CFO, youre the head of sales and you kind of have to do the whole thing. In terms of investors, I guess two comments. Now my cofounders were phenomenal in bringing them to meetings. Got it and before we actually dive in to the journey here, so consulting and. You can set the expectations and then see what happens and if its not a good fit upfront, you can go with the different option on the table. Got it. Raising money first, marketplace businesses is still really difficult and Ive raised $90 million and Im still saying it is difficult. For me, its Zumper, an apartment rental platform. They were [sexy 23:47] company and really fantastic fundraisers but the rounds just take a long time, due diligence take a long time. Anthemos Georgiades: Yeah. Anthemos Georgiades: Yeah. So I guess for those listeners that are looking at acquiring other companies to perhaps grow a little bit faster, what kind of advice would you give to them? And investors love that story because its easy to believe that you can continue to do that. Well help you prequalify renters and actually get the renter in to a lease, signing the documents, paying the first month deposit but well charge you a percentage of the lease fairly. His passion for relieving the stress for others in . It was at the time Pat Mapper example almost the same size on consumer but now Zumper is much bigger but we called it like a cheat and your job as the founder is to identify like vertical cheats where overnight you become bigger than your competitors. Were incredibly grateful for everything she did and she remains kind of shareholder in the company. So you know I think Axle Springer very used to appraising companies that match their scale. And then my other cofounder Kurt Taylor I met through his mother who was an [04:43] and it was another example of just pure hustle. Yeah. Everyone in Boston, everyone in New York were straight nos and [25:15] didnt get second meetings but then a month later we came to Silicon Valley and we found a much better product market set for the kind of investor who was prepared to come early and invest early and we got a lot of yeses very quickly. When people ask me what Im most nervous about its how to keep our amazing team together, a couple of tactics and then one thing that really worked. So our CFO is fantastic and what he was able to bring to the series C was real credibility where I meet the investors, get them excited about our vision and our story and then they spend hours with the CFO on the second or third meeting digesting our historical financial as were talking about where were headed. It is your job not just to do the day to day but once or twice a year you should be doing stuff that has a completely linear outcome where one day youre doing you know 3 million users a month and the next day youre doing 5 million users a month. I have no experience doing that. I was really impressed when because its not hard, its almost impossible to land VC such as Kleiner Perkins on literally your first financing round, the seed round. I grew up in London. If you want me to help you with your fundraising, just book a call. No. It was just purely hustling my network for six months to find people who are really great cultural fit but also have very different skill sets to the one I have. I know entrepreneurs who spend nine months raising their rounds which is a long time but they got great rounds done. Ill set the first couple of meetings often alone but its been wonderful as weve grown our executive team to be able to bring like our VP of sales, our head of grow, our CPO in to the meetings afterwards when they want to meet the team. Got it. Keeping good lines of communication open can solve many landlord/tenant problems. Anthemos Georgiades. Got it. Yeah. Over-Communication. It was just purely hustling my network for six months to find people who are really great cultural fit but also have very different skill sets to the one I have. Got it. Anthemos Georgiades, Zumper, European Founder, International Founders, Marketplace The process of renting apartments hasn't changed since Craigslist was introduced. Anthemos Georgiades: Yeah. So I guess what was the timeline of this C round compared to perhaps your seed round of 2012? How much respect is there? And to be fair, some of these 20 did indeed come back later to invest but in Boston and I pitched all of the east coast investors first because I was on the east coast and they were straight nos. I think the startups end up wasting a lot of cash that could really extend runway but thats a different conversation. So the majority of that is still in the bank but yeah, we raised money in capital [12:00]. Retention is something I think about every day. Saying that, in the early days you kind of need to bring on all the capital that you can. I guess the question that I would ask you and perhaps some advice for some of those that are listening, that are building a business that is more around the network effects, the marketplaces, should they walk the other way if the investor is asking too much about revenue early on on the financing cycles? So paradoxically, I dont think the core DNA of a companys culture is built at ski tracks or offsite. And then when I moved out to America, Russel was software engineer at Google and I had no technical background so I basically hit up my network for anyone with a technical background living in the US who might be interested in joining and Russel and I really hit it off and he was the perfect cofounder. Get Anthemos Georgiades's email address (a*****@zumper.com) and phone number (646398..) at RocketReach. So I saw for example Axle Springer which is you know more kind of like the corporate. At college in the UK, Ive had like multiple [00:58] renting apartments. At series B, you got to show product market set across the board with the revenue and then at series C, you got to show real traction and real revenue and a proper P&L. And then my other cofounder Kurt Taylor I met through his mother who was an [04:43] and it was another example of just pure hustle. Anthemos Georgiades: Oh yeah, on the seed round back in 2012, we had probably five investors come in to the seed round so we kind of had five yeses who put in small checks. We both wanted to be entrepreneurs. Yeah. You look at your cofounders and you know that they understand that and that theyre not freaking out, that is where you build real institutional culture and then you try and grow that across the team. And then as we looked at the C round, Axle Springer are fantastic good example [19:59]. And so I wouldnt be too pressured. Anthemos Georgiades: Yeah, I mean BCG I think you get access to the 23 year olds CEOs who had been working for 40 years and kind of crazy in consulting you take the shortcut in your careers to being in the board room. So for Zumper our vision as I mentioned was to make renting an apartment as easy as booking a hotel and so instead of going in with just an idea, I built like a really crappy version of the end game that I wanted to build. But was drawn in to it just to solve a problem as I think so many entrepreneurs are. This pellet stove is a good heating solution for a smaller rather than a . And were they like obviously now youre opening here the cap table to a different breed and I guess when that happen probably at a strategic level lets say from a board perspective or something you know, maybe you receive some type of recommendations whether it was with this corporation or with other corporations as to what perhaps to look for and what to avoid. Yeah, I think its probably the DNA of your culture is I think a lot of it is built in the tough times. The reality is often in the early stages, youre going to want to take all the capital thats given to you and you may not have multiple term sheets. Anthemos Georgiades: Yeah. You can set the expectations and then see what happens and if its not a good fit upfront, you can go with the different option on the table. How autonomous can people be at the junior levels? I mean youre doing various jobs, head of sales, head of finance, head of fundraising, head of like DZ. It was not something Ive really ever thought about before. Anthemos Georgiades Current Workplace Zumper Location 555 Montgomery St Ste 1300, San Francisco, California, 94111, United States Industry Information Collection & Delivery, Media & Internet Description Discover more about Zumper Anthemos Georgiades Work Experience and Education Work Experience Manager, Summer Investment Atomico 2009-2010 Two sided marketplaces are so difficult. Anthemos Georgiades. Alejandro: Got it. You just cant get spooked. Get 5 free searches. And in terms of preparation, Anthemos, how has the preparation like preparing before going to market to start engaging investors, how have you seen with your business, with Zumper, how have you seen that changed over time as the rounds were maturing? Yeah. Your second month you spend getting term sheets and documents signed. I knew the CEO for a while. Could you meet him? And so whereas that doesnt guarantee any success we obviously have to have really good numbers and a really good story to tell them. Got it. And in terms of preparation, Anthemos, how has the preparation like preparing before going to market to start engaging investors, how have you seen with your business, with Zumper, how have you seen that changed over time as the rounds were maturing? And then at business school, I think the single biggest thing I learned through the case study method which is how they teach it at Harvard Business School but I think its true. But theres no right answer in business. So it doesnt always work out and I think thats fine. Obviously they knew and I think for us it was like telling Axle and the rest of our investors that there are going to be months where we massively beat plans and there will be months where were behind plans. And so back to your point, yes, we want investors who are supportive of the fact that we didnt try to monetize the platform for the first three years because it would have created a barrier to entry. When you look your cofounders, your team in the eye and you know theyre ready to go and theyre resilient and they come back in to build and try the next thing and youve kind of worked out together this is part of the game. Were growing very quickly but none of that was true obviously in the first two years. "These markets had a huge net migration from New York and California, and they have held up," he says. I met Russel who [04:01] engineering products through just the personal connections in London. Obviously they knew and I think for us it was like telling Axle and the rest of our investors that there are going to be months where we massively beat plans and there will be months where were behind plans. They are brilliant about. So you acquire not long ago Pat Mapper and how did this come together? And so I wouldnt be too pressured. Published by at June 13, 2022. Its not about the ski trips and any of that you know. Well, Anthemos, it has been a pleasure to have you on the show. In the early days you as the CEO you are the fundraiser, you are the effective CFO, youre the head of sales and you kind of have to do the whole thing. We both had ideas to be entrepreneurs but neither of us have the guts to actually go for it. So we have several million users using our platform every month now which is great and next year we wanted tens of millions of users a month and were poised to doing that. Yeah. So we solved it to the first two years purely by getting landlords on board through various kind of product strategy and so our growth cuts for the first two years that we raised the [27:41] were purely about landlords and listing. How flat is the company? So the majority of that is still in the bank but yeah, we raised money in capital [12:00]. Saying that, in the early days you kind of need to bring on all the capital that you can. A lot of it was completely bottom up. Get a custom action plan and all the help that you need to start raising more capital. Absolutely. Its really built in the dark days of when stuff is really difficult and I think Zumpers culture now is we have a lot of users still remembers and its a testament to those dark days and we never take anything for granted. And were they like obviously now youre opening here the cap table to a different breed and I guess when that happen probably at a strategic level lets say from a board perspective or something you know, maybe you receive some type of recommendations whether it was with this corporation or with other corporations as to what perhaps to look for and what to avoid. Well, Anthemos, it has been a pleasure to have you on the show. Really, really nice to have you here and excited for the chat that we have ahead here. Anthemos lives in San Francisco, where Zumper is HQd, with his wife. I learned more from you than you learned from me, and then your job as CEO is to do kind of two or three things, that is to continue to advance like the vision and the mission of the company and keep everything strategically aligned. Its really built in the dark days of when stuff is really difficult and I think Zumpers culture now is we have a lot of users still remembers and its a testament to those dark days and we never take anything for granted. Yeah. Everyone in Boston, everyone in New York were straight nos and [25:15] didnt get second meetings but then a month later we came to Silicon Valley and we found a much better product market set for the kind of investor who was prepared to come early and invest early and we got a lot of yeses very quickly. Fantastic. I think just up front boundaries before you close the round is super important. And for you I guess personally and professionally because I think they both come together, so how has your leadership and management skills changed over the time from leading the company of lets say four to ten folks initially to a company of over a hundred employees? I really enjoyed it and great stuff. I'm so proud of my wife Lucy Georgiades and her cofounder Lindsey Nehls on launching their business Elevate Academy today. We saw it would take three to six months to integrate Pat Mapper and their backend that engineering project we worked really hard and quickly just over a year to integrate so we underestimated like how much work was required to integrate them by 3x. So I wouldnt be too picky early. @zumper Stories Uncategorized Now we have supply so the six months curve at the series B was all about users and millions of monthly users and then at the series C it was much more revenue curve. I knew the CEO for a while. Hes raising money now. And your cap table I mean as I was reviewing I just felt as I was looking at the Oscars of Silicon Valley, the red carpet. So M&A are strategic [33:48]. Township Of Ocean Police Department. Anthemos Georgiades: Yeah. Unluckily weve made some phenomenal early hires so the company that have all scaled to leadership roles, thats fantastic for retention because those people know that we could have hired from outside but we bet on them and it worked and so Zumper is a place to build theyre career not somewhere else. So Anthemos, whats the business model here? Over time, its great to be able to bring in your team. Anthemos Georgiades: No. I dont think theres a startup I could have launched that taught me more. So I guess how did that consulting experience shape up your approach in terms of like tackling problems and the entrepreneurial journey itself? Hello, everyone, to the DealMakers Show. Georgiades founded Zumper after his own . [06:54] the early days and it worked where there was just all hands to the pump. Got it. But I guess you were saying then here the shift, kind of like shifted more from like growth of users perhaps retention to more kind of like deep revenue growth. So in terms of timeline, you were mentioning that the C round, you guys closed this 46 million a couple of months ago. So I as British person moving to Silicon Valley in 2012 I have never run a startup before. It is ultimately the culture. We love our investors. Since 2012, Georgiades has grown Zumper to over 200 employees, 178 million annual visits, and raised $178 million in venture capital for the company. If you guys are Zumper website, you can kind of kind at zumper.com the Contact Us or on Twitter I am just @anthemos, A-N-T-H-E-M-O-S on Twitter and yeah, I respond to people. Look how quickly our revenue are scaling. So today, we have another founder and another one that is quite successful in their own paths. And we built this website using an outsource development shop in Europe that just tested one assumption of the end game which was can we get users in 2011, 2012 just as mobile was coming online to apply and close apartments from their phone. August 4, 2020. Taylor Glass-Moore Co-Founder. 1. Every company is completely different and theres no gold standard. Alejandro: Of course. And then at business school, I think the single biggest thing I learned through the case study method which is how they teach it at Harvard Business School but I think its true. In many instances, really acquisitions are great to either feel growth on the company itself, either on the product or perhaps by adding a great talent, but unfortunately many M&A transactions fail really on the integration side of things. Remember to unlock for free the pitch deck template that is being used by founders around the world to raise millions below. It happened but I wouldnt say its like an obvious part. Yeah. And we were talking about the $46 million round which was the C round, C as in cat and basically what you were talking about I mean what Ive seen is that you guys have shifted a little bit the strategy. So you still have to land it and once youre on the door it doesnt matter where you come from you have to have something good. But was drawn in to it just to solve a problem as I think so many entrepreneurs are. For us, I think they fully understand the entrepreneurial journey and were really excited to have them on board. He runs all the background of operation and he came from the real estate industry, two completely different background and neither of them was an obvious pick when I started the company at grad school. Got it. How many listings do we have on the site? All of it is going to be important and it will come out at the right stage. He discovered that the marketplace doesnt work for renters, and the idea for Zumper was born with the goal of evening the playing field and increasing transparency in the marketplace.